Dr. James Fetzer: This is Jim Fetzer, your
host on the Real Deal. My very special guest for the first hour
of this show today is an expert on covert ops, one of the best
minds I know at unraveling what is going on in the world. We
are going to talk about the catastrophe in Gulf of Mexico which
seems to pose a huge threat, even to the existence
of the human species on earth. His name is Jim Viken, and I
am so pleased to have him back on the show. Jim, welcome to
the Real Deal.
Dr. James Viken: Thank you Jim. I am glad to
Dr. Fetzer: What I want to know today, Jim,
is what is the real deal about the Gulf of Mexico, BP and this
oil spill? Do you think this was a deliberate, or an accident,
or is it stage-managed? Are we being manipulated? What
in the hell is going on?
Dr. Viken: Well, because the mass media is
controlled, and because of the five or six major news corporations
at least three of them are linked to defense contractors, talking
points are disseminated to news people, and they are really
there to do concensus and read the talking points. They know
that if they depart from the agenda, bad things happen. Now
take Larry King, for example. I think the guy has tried. Some
people don' t like him, but I have always liked him, and the
thing is you never know where he stands because he has never
evaluated anything. But he believes in letting people talk.
When he had Jesse Ventura on, and Jesse talked about 9/11, and
suggested it was an inside job, you could see Larry wince, but
he didn't interrupt him. He didn't interfere. And immediately
after that, within the next week or so, he was punished by the
media for his divorce, ridiculed, had an hour long program ridiculing
him, and I think to counter that he had Jesse come on and actually
run his show. So I have got to give the guy credit. But most
people in the media are frightened to tell the truth. For example,
if you read the book Into
the Buzzsaw, it talks about a number of top investigative
journalists whose lives were particularly ruined or destroyed
because they dared to write the truth. And there are many stories
about this, but my main point would be that because the media
spreads this party line that is coming from the government and
the corporations that control it, such as BP, it isn't just
BP, it is the banks behind them like Goldman Sachs with all
their interchanging directors, that we cannot get a good view
on what happened. Now I know that I recently had a call from
a retired lady that I know down in Texas. She was upset because
she had talked to someone who worked on the oil platform. They
said that two to three weeks beforehand there was talk among
the management on the platform of cracks appearing in the surface
of the ocean-bed. I don't know, there was no talk whatsoever
of anything oozing out of the water, but she said that this
guy told her that there were cracks and he was very concerned
and a lot of people on the rig knew that there was something
wrong. There was an irregular thing being done with the drilling.
That did not get into the news. What we have heard for anecdotal
reports is that there have now been fissures recognized in the
ocean floor and possibly oil leaking up to twenty miles away
through the fissures. We know that there have been reports,
fairly good reports, that there has been oil leaking through
fissures up to two miles away. And that cracking is one of the
things that can happen when you drill wells. You can get cracking
in the substrata and that then if there is a casing problem
the oil under pressure will come up in another location. Now
that is what appears to be happening. But there is other reports
of minor leaks from other platforms not too far away, so it
is very hard to know what is going on. We do know another thing
for sure, and that is that BP is now controlling the Coast Guard,
telling them what to do. They are giving orders to the local
police to arrest news people who take pictures where they are
not supposed to be, in public areas. And it also that BP has
been given complete police powers. So whatever it is that is
going on, Jim, we are not going to have an easy time finding
Dr. Fetzer: This idea that BP is running the
police officials down there is stunning to me, Jim. I mean,
it certainly suggests we are living in a fascist corporate-dominated
state, and Barack Obama seems to me to be a spineless weakling
here. I have not seen him take any steps that are significant
in controlling this problem.
Dr. Viken: No, and you really wonder what and
who has the authority, at what level, to tell the Coast Guard,
you are going to take orders from BP's security. And when they
tell you to arrest people, or move them out of an area, you
are going to do it. Who had that authority? That had to come
from a pretty high level.
Dr. Fetzer: That is just stunning.
Dr. Viken: Jim, it is like there has been a
destruction of the rule of law in this country. You know one
of the things that happened in Germany was there was a point
where Germany had all kinds of laws protecting people, in fact
Hitler sold himself as a true socialist, social security for
everybody, and jobs, much like a Democratic platform, and once
he had the power base, after the burning of the Reichstag, and
after he murdered all the people who got him into power, purged
them out just like Stalin, when the treachery was completed,
now all at once he had so much power that all the people's rights
were put on the shelf, and anybody that protested against him
in any way was accused of being unpatriotic or not loyal to
Germany. Now it kind of seems to me that the same thing is happening
Dr. Fetzer: Well, you know, something that
stuns me Jim is that the seriousness of this isn't being acknowledged
on any hand. It has got not only the potential to turn the Gulf
of Mexico into a Dead Sea, by destroying all forms of life there,
but to move throughout the oceans of the world and commit similar
havoc. And of course all life is dependent upon organisms that
come from the ocean, so if the oceans are destroyed, then all
other forms of life are destined to extinction and that includes
Dr. Viken: Well, that is true, and that is
why it is so important that we know what is really going on.
And it may be that the government itself did not know what is
really going on. Maybe even BP does not really know what is
going on. Maybe this thing was set up as a deep cover black
op so that nobody has a full picture except the very people
at the top. Now there are some very, very strange occurrences.
You know, they have been anecdotally documented. For example,
all the talk that there were problems with the way the well
was coming in. The fact that Halliburton or KBR were down there
doing irregular things like packing the well casing with water,
sea water, instead of proper mud there, concrete. It was not
being done properly. The fact that a faulty relief valve, safety
valve was installed, even though there was a fight, a verbal
argument on the oil rig, hours before. Some people were saying,
this thing is dangerous. This is not right. This valve won't
work. So you have prior knowledge of problems and a rush to
proceed anyway and you have a strange ship appearing the day
before. And you have to ask what is that ship doing there. Then
you have the other occurrences, now some of them have appeared
in print in the mainstream media, such as the CEO of BP selling
a large chunk of his stock ahead of time. Then you have the
Chairman of Goldman Sachs who used to be the Chairman of BP,
I guess a year before. You have Goldman Sachs involved, you
have Goldman Sachs shorting the stock, or whatever, and I guess
a recovered email saying that if the oil well does not produce
as we expect, we are going to make billions. So far they have
made 95 billion dollars profit because this well does not come
in properly. So you know that there is all this background,
and then you have to wonder about it. Of course the fact that
Halliburton apparently a couple of weeks before bought "Coots"
[Editor's Note: "Boots
& Coots"] or whatever that company in Texas where
they have a long history of fighting well problems, they can
put out well fires. They are in Iraq, they are apparently the
top disaster experts for oil. So now what happens is you have
a proven conflict of interest with Halliburton because of their
purchase of that company ahead of time, so they are making extreme
profits off this disaster because of that purchase. And one
of the sharpest investments a person could ever make, and of
course it really makes you wonder whether there was prior knowledge,
why would they spend millions of dollars buying this company
unless they knew something big was going to happen?
Dr. Fetzer: Well, it is very scary Jim. I have
read estimates that this is unstoppable, and that as much as
a billion barrels of oil may eventually come out of this massive
reservoir which is supposed to be the second largest in the
world, which obviously implies that we have a super abundance
of oil, and also contradicts the theory of oil as a fossil fuel.
Dr. Viken: That is right.
Dr. Fetzer: So we seem to be in a situation
where the world's greatest calamity, the greatest environmental
disaster which is going to overshadow all others by many orders
of magnitude is upon us, and nothing is taking place except
the positioning of police forces and the military along the
coast to keep reporters from reporting what is actually going
on? Jim, that seems to be what's the deal. [10:27]
Dr. Viken: Well, Jim, there is another confusing
thing too. You have to ask yourself about all the U.N. trucks.
Over 800 U.N. Trucks over the last year and a half were brought
in. I don't remember the state, one of the Southern states.
At an airfield. I think I sent out a photo of that. And what
are they getting ready for? And there is a very, very muted
response to this. You talk to people who live down in the coastal
area, and I have, and one of the things that you find is there
is extreme anger down there in the families, but they are afraid
to say too much because a lot of the other family members work
on the oil rigs. So you have some of the families in the fishing
business, and some of the brothers and sisters also work on
the oil rigs. And the oil people, many of them, if not all of
them, are made to sign statements that they will not talk agreements
right after the disaster. They know that if they open their
mouth, they are all done. They will never work for any oil company,
not just BP. They will be blacklisted. So there is a conspiracy
to keep people quiet. But one of the things that is leaking
out is that the local people down there are very angry because
they see all the equipment sitting on the shore, booms and such.
There are hundreds of ships that have volunteered to help go
out with booms. They have been told no, we don't want your help.
The Governors of those Gulf States are furious, some of them
have tried going out on their own doing maintenance, but they
have been stopped by the Coast Guard. They are taking berms
out and some of them are excavating and changing coral patterns
and the government has stopped everything. It is almost as if
the government's main goal right now is to stop the clean up,
slow it down, and create a situation where as much damage as
possible is being done.
Fetzer: As much damage as possible is being
done, Jim. How corrupt is that? How bad is that? I mean, you
know extinguishing a species is in the offing here. I mean this
is not merely theoretical. If this oil keeps gushing out in
this volume, it has the capacity to decimate all living forms
in all the oceans of the world. .
Dr. Viken: That is right. Now you know that
the latest estimate is two million gallons a day. Now there
are 44 gallons in a barrel. So if you have a calculator there,
you can take two million divided by 44, that would tell how
many barrels a day are leaking. That is the latest estimate.
Dr. Fetzer: My understanding too Jim is that
the whole thing is shattered and fragmented and now oil is leaking
all over this very fragile bottom of the Gulf of Mexico.
Dr. Viken: That is right.
Dr. Fetzer: And it is unstoppable.
Dr. Viken: Supposedly the pressure that came
in was estimated to be over 70,000 psi. Now that is a lot of
pressure. And many of the people, that are familiar with --
engineers and whatever, have said it is most likely the well
casing itself is being damaged now if it is not completely eroded,
because the sand and silt itself coming out from below is like
an abrasive, like sand-blasting the wall off.
Dr. Fetzer: Right, right, right. Which of course
is going to open, increase the opening.
Dr. Viken: Right.
Dr. Fetzer: -- And widen it even further and
allow larger volume to come gushing out.
Dr. Viken: And then of course there are a number
of people I would call them -- there are some individuals that
are well aware of government weather control technology going
back to the 50's when they started it. And it has been admitted
in some of the declassified government documents that they do
have ways to control the weather. Cloud-seeding, electronic
means. They have ways to control earthquakes. Years ago they
did cross-drilling and they put nuclear-tipped torpedoes down.
There are ways to control the weather using HAARP and various
technologies, and there are some individuals that think that
it is possible that our government used some of this technology
to create a problem. In other words, there isn't just
a bad well. There are other bad things which are being done
to create fissures down there. You see when there is so much
government secrecy, and there is so much money and abuse of
power, by the people in control, we have no way to know what
they are doing or how crazy they are. Now we do know one thing,
Jim. They are not managing this properly. We know another thing.
They probably don't care two hoots about the people down there
because if they did, they would manage it better. So you have
to ask yourself, what does the government have to gain by handling
this? And the answer is, a lot. And the reason is you have to
look at what happened with -- the government lied, the global
warming tax, carbon tax, all these various things -- and of
course with the leak of the emails, showing that global warming
exists --but that through the natural cycles man-made global
warming is less than one percent of it, and it is insignificant
-- when those emails were released showing that the data that
was used for formulating U.S. policy was fake, that whole movement
crumbled. And my view is that this is the shadow government's
answer to that. To find if that is the way you want to play
now, we are going to play hardball. And a number of people such
as myself view this as another 9/11. Now we know now that this
first World Trade Center bombing, we know that was a false flag
attack that was a sting gone bad, whereas the --.
Dr. Fetzer: You are talking about 1993.
Viken: Right. The FBI insisted that the Muslim
extremists used real explosives, they didn't want to. But then
a major accident happened. It was supposed to be called a [terror
event]. We now know for sure, according to released government
documents, eyewitnesses, and people in the various government
agencies that are talking now and admitting that Murrah was
an inside job done by our own intelligence agencies. We know
that it was a sting gone bad. Except these people were set up
to it. They had other bombs on the inside the building, came
in xerox boxes, sat next to the columns. We know the bomb squad
was there. We know that was another inside job created as a
sting gone bad. And we also know that the 9/11 attacks were
set up, you know, in that same perspective where you have anywhere
estimates of 11 to 17 military exercises that day. Vigilant
Guardian and all the rest. When the planes started going off
the radar, you had the FAA tapes saying "It that part of
the exercise, or is that real?" So we know that all the
air defenses shut down. We had the most heavily fortified cities
in the world, New York and Washington, D.C., both of them protected
with ground to air missiles controlled by radar and satellite,
and F-16s that are required to intercept within six minutes.
We know all of that was turned off and shut down. And of course
a guy in a cave in Afghanistan with a cell phone would have
to be awfully powerful to do that.
Dr. Fetzer: [Laughter] [17:50]
Dr. Viken: So the people are starting to catch
on. So what happens, I think, is the government figures we have
got to do something. People are catching on. We have to have
another 9/11, but these people are very crafty. Now I never
would have expected that they would have pulled anything like
this with the Gulf thing. It caught me off guard. It slipped
under my radar screen.
Dr. Fetzer: Well Jim, did this just get out
of control? I mean you know what benefit can come come from
creating an evolutionary scenario that leads to the extinction
of the human species? I mean I realize these people are not
rocket scientists and they may have limited understanding of
ecology and evolution, but the risk represented by this disaster
Jim far overshadows anything that the world has ever seen.
Dr. Viken: Unless that is what they want. Now
my advisor in graduate school used to tell me that the people
running things --the international bankers-- are all eugenicists.
And he said not only that, they are all nuts. They want to kill
us all. And I used to laugh and I never believed it. It took
me years and years to learn about this stuff. I think he was
right. If you go look at the Georgia Guidestones down where
where they have the new Ten Commandments for the world, the
first one is to reduce the world population by 80%. If you talk
to or look at the British aristocrats and the philosophers in
Great Britain, at the same time, the Club of Rome, all the population
control, they want to reduce the population at a minimum, 80%.
Some of them say 90%. So when you have that kind of thinking
with the most powerful people that run the world, you have to
believe maybe these people are serious, and maybe they really
want to take us back to the Stone Age. Because if the reports
are accurate, that we are losing two millions gallons out of
that well into the Gulf a day, if that is accurate, Jim, this
could take the United States back into the Stone Age.
Dr. Fetzer: I think that is right, Jim. I think
it has the potential because of the currents. This oil is going
to be swept around the world. Around the oceans of the world.
I think it has the potential to take the entire earth back to
the Stone Age.
Dr. Viken: That is possible. Now some of the
petroleum engineers have said, "Well, left to itself, the
longest it could possibly run would be two to four years. That
each deposit has its own limits. But we really don't know that.
Dr. Fetzer: But then we get the reports Jim
that two kinds of supplemental catastrophe. One, there is a
report of an enormous gas bubble that is some ten by twenty
miles in width. That if it were to explode, would cause enormous
waves. You know, a real bona fide tsunami.
Dr. Viken: Right. There are some people who
are saying there is a real gas bubble held down underwater.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes.
Dr. Viken: What would hold that down? Because
usually you know like when you have divers or diving, the gases
that they exhale, unless you have rebreathers, blow up to the
surface. But what would keep it [down]? Is it subterranean gas
or -- ?
Dr. Fetzer: I cannot imagine. But the other
report is that as this oil comes out, it is leaving a weakening
there of the shelf, which could collapse, and water pour into
what I take to be extremely high temperatures at that subterranean
level, which could cause another kind of eruption.
Dr. Viken: It could be from a volcano.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes.
Dr. Viken: I think there are other places in
the world where there are subterranean volcanoes periodically.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes, yes, yes. There are.
Dr. Viken: But they are not related to oil.
Dr. Fetzer: Well I don't think they are on
this scale, this magnitude and in such a sensitive area in terms
of civilized life.
Dr. Viken: You really have to wonder, sometimes
you wonder, where is Obama in all this because his first order
out of the White House was to send SWAT teams to all the oil
rigs. So I wonder if his advisors led him to believe it was
a terrorist attack. That is the way he responded.
Dr. Fetzer: He sent SWAT teams to oil rigs?
Dr. Viken: Right.
Dr. Fetzer: That is bizarre, Jim.
Dr. Viken: That was his first response.
Dr. Fetzer: That is bizarre, Jim, I was unaware
of that, but that is bizarre. Now who is --
Dr. Viken: You have to wonder how much power
he really has. What has he really been told? With many of our
presidents, they have been given limited amounts of information.
They are controlled by the information given to them by their
Dr. Fetzer: Yep, yep, yes. Well, I just can't
fathom who benefits from this. I mean, I understand that BP
was cutting all kinds of corners. There was no supervision.
This is a manifestation of the deregulation mantra of the Republicans
over the last thirty years.
Dr. Viken: That is true.
Dr. Fetzer: We should hold no one more responsible
politically than the GOP. And of course you have heard these
disgusting remarks from politicians suggesting that even this
rather trivial twenty billion dollar compensation fund from
BP is a form of shakedown which is completely ridiculous. I
mean there is a potential here for BP to declare bankruptcy,
reorganize, and not pay a nickel towards cleanup, Jim.
Dr. Viken: The minimum it will cost is a trillion
dollars, and probably three to five.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes.
Dr. Viken: Probably a third of our GDP. But
there is another angle on the BP situation that you have to
ask yourself about. You know BP has a long history of pushing
for environmentalism and Green stuff. Now one of the things
that shocked me the most years ago, I used to live next door
to a guy, I won't mention the organization, but it was a conservative,
like a nature organization that lobbied and whatever, and they
brought people to Minnesota and were surveying the farms, taking
pictures of the farms and stuff. One of the surveyors was asked
"Why are you here," and he said "We are surveying
all the farms. We will probably buy them all up in the future."
This is like 12 to 15 years ago. I thought that was nuts. Now
I am starting to wonder if they have a long term plan. And I
found out that this particular foundation was being funded by
the oil companies. And I thought, what the heck, why would the
oil companies fund? These foundations are against drilling any
oil. They are against any kind of development of resources or
minerals or anything. They fight everything. Why would they
support their enemy? And BP has a long history of this, pushing
for carbon credits, all of this stuff. Suicidal stuff. Self-defeating
stuff. So you have to ask yourself how you would explain this.
You can go back and read a lot of the literature that some of
the kooky British eugenicists wrote at the turn of the century,
what they talked about was putting key people in organizations
and we will give them a golden parachute and you work for us,
and we will make sure you are taken care of when we put in our
New World Order. But at the right time you have to jettison
the company. You have to sacrifice the company, take it down
in order for a higher goal, for the good of mankind, for preserving
the species. And that we will make sure you are part of our
new little club. Have you heard that one before?
Dr. Fetzer: Jim, this is all very scary stuff.
We are going to take our first break, Jim, then we will return
to our conversation about the BP disaster in the Gulf of Mexico.
This is Jim Fetzer, your host on the Real Deal with my very
special guest, Jim Viken. We will be right back. [25:31 beginning
of break...31:25 end of break]
Dr. Fetzer: This is Jim Fetzer, your host on
the Real Deal. Continuing my conversation with Jim Viken about
the BP Disaster in the Gulf of Mexico which poses risks heretofore
un-confronted by the human species, because once one level in
the food chain is extinguished, all higher species have their
survival threatened. It is virtually inevitable, Jim, it is
what you might call a law of evolution. So I view this with
the most grave concern. Can you tell me this. Offer this insight,
Jim. Who could stand to make money off of a disaster like this?
Dr. Viken: Well Jim, this goes back into the
question, who benefits from a problem this great? You have to
ask yourself who really is in control? I think the answer to
all these questions is the shadow government. And Richard Boylan,
Phd, did the best analysis of it. It is on his web site if you
dig for it. You can surf on Google shadow
government, Richard Boylan. I think what happened
is that the shadow government has always existed, but it uses
war to gain more power. A lot of the companies that were small
because of the war profiteering that went on during World War
I and World War II became way too powerful, and it was such
a drastic increase in power that President Eisenhower, who was
really one of them initially, he could not stomach it any more.
In his last speech in the White House he talked about the military-industrial
complex and the threat that it posed. Undue influence over our
society. I think that what has happened is it has gotten so
powerful it has become a secretive or hidden bureaucracy that
is superior, it is at a higher level than our own government.
Our government works for these people and takes orders from
them. And if you really look at the shadow government, you find
out that the banking, the oil, the military, the defense contractors,
these people are at a medium level. They are above the government,
they control the government. But these people are not independent.
They are controlled by, I call them "gurus." You have
the old Black nobility, the various people on the Committee
of 300, you have people involved in esoteric, secret societies.
And these people are really kinked out. If you really research
it, you find out they are not like us. They have their own set
of beliefs. Most of them are nuts. And they believe in eugenics.
They want to herd us. They believe that in order to preserve
the human race, you have to thin the herd. They are agents of
death. So they view war as an act of God. And because of that,
they think that they are helping humankind when they create
mass war and create mass death. And this is their history. And
they believe that people are reincarnated so that they are really
helping to move people to a higher level. And that suffering
is good. Of course it is always for everyone else, not for themselves.
Eugenics is great as long as you are not the one doing it to
yourself. And I think this is the only explanation. These people
are crazy enough and they are kinked out enough, so that they
are weird and occult enough spiritually, they really think they
are acting out on behalf of God and saving the world and saving
the human race. Now how is that for crazy, Jim?
Dr. Fetzer: You are telling me that the lunatics
are running the asylum.
Dr. Viken: Yes, yes. But most lunatics in mental
institutions, most of them are harmless. You know they run around,
and maybe spin their wheels all day. They really don't harm
anybody. They might wind up on the streets, getting run over
by a street car or a train or something or a bus. Most of them
are harmless. But these people are criminally insane.
There is a difference. These people are beyond sociopaths. They
live by bloodlust. To them, death is great. You know, like look
at Henry Kissinger. There are warrants out for his arrest for
mass murder in some of your countries where he will not visit
anymore. What is it, Myanmar
where they say he was responsible for a million deaths. Look
at Pol Pot, you have to ask who put Pol Pot in power? -- Our
intelligence agencies. I mean, these people are the mass murderers.
And now we have a government in which through different administrations
has continued to support unprovoked wars resulting in the deaths
of over a million civilians, Jim.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes, yes, yes. And the beat goes
on. I mean over two million Vietnamese died in that conflict.
And of course, I mean Iraq and Afghanistan, they did not even
keep count in that first Gulf War, Jim. I mean it was such a
slaughter, it was so brutal, that Highway of Death. [36:25]
Dr. Viken: Life magazine had a photographic
journal of that event. But I talked to someone whose son flew
a Warthog in that attack, and he said that they were all angry
because they blamed some of the best of their soldiers, some
of their friends in the Kuwaitean Army, you know they blamed
the Iraqis for it. But he said when they came down and opened
up their guns, body parts were flying for miles. They just chewed
them up. I don't know how many they killed in one pass, that
many thousands of troops, and again, all unprovoked. We set
Sadam Hussein up. We sold them the poison gases. We sold them
everything. We made them into a boogeyman so that he would fight
Iran, and then when we were done with him, he would not follow
orders, and then of course we sent the Jackals in, and when
that didn't work, then we sent the Army in. Now I had one very
trusted friend who I contacted, and I asked him. I said all
right, I want to know who really runs things. Who are these
creeps who really runs things. He said "Have you ever been
to Washington, D.C. and seen the capitol building?" I said
no. And he said if you do, there is a statue on top of the capitol
building. I said, "OK, I have seen it in pictures."
I said "What is it?" and he said, "Persephone,
the goddess of the underworld. Goddess of minerals, it goes
back to Greek and Roman times." He said "The people
that run the minerals on the earth, oil companies and the gold
and everyone, those are the people who rule the world and always
have." He said "It goes all the way back to Babylonia.
They have always maintained control. If you want to understand
who runs everything, look at those companies and those families."
Have you ever heard that before Jim?
Dr. Fetzer: No, that is very scary, Jim.
Dr. Viken: And they had enough power to get
put up on the Capitol Building and have her rebuilt for
Dr. Fetzer: That is completely bizarre. Completely
Dr. Viken: Check it out. I couldn't believe
it. I checked it out and it is all true. Not only that, but
they just recently had her rebuilt. It cost a lot of money,
Dr. Fetzer: I have heard multiple stories about
strange things happening shortly before this blowout occurred.
That Halliburton was down there. That there were the federal
inspectors who had been doing a terrible, terrible job, anyway.
Dr. Viken: Right.
Dr. Fetzer: I mean, what in the world was setting
this up, Jim? Let's just be --.
Dr. Viken: At one level, it was criminal negligence,
and at another level it was ordinary negligence for the workers
who did not know anything and had no authority, but for the
workers in higher positions, it was criminal negligence. And
at the highest levels it was complete criminal negligence and
murder. There were eleven people who died there, and
it was murder. Because people at the top making decisions said,
"Let it go." They were told there was a problem with
the valves, it is warped, and they said "Let it go."
They were told that the mud was not being put in properly, and
they were told, "Let it go. We cannot spend any more money
Dr. Fetzer: Yes. "Let it go."
Dr. Viken: That is criminal negligence at a
minimum, isn't it Jim?
Dr. Fetzer: Absolutely. And of course they
were trying to do it all on the cheap. And the fact is there
were these cutoff valves that could easily have been installed
that other nations require be installed when they allow any
drilling to take place that were not installed here.
Dr. Viken: So who is running who? Is the government
running the oil companies, or is it the other way around? I
would say the shadow government which is largely composed of
oil companies is really running our government and most of the
governments of the world. And when you look at the amount of
revenue that is running through these oil companies, it is unbelievable.
Dr. Fetzer: Well you remember when Bush and
Cheney were in office they made all these political appointees,
many of whom appeared to have had close ties to the oil industry,
and then they elevated social security ranks so that these people
will have turned out to have lifetime tenure. I mean, what a
Dr. Viken: That is right. That is right. Jim,
you know this thing went under my radar. I knew the government
had to do another 9/11 type thing this summer, but I thought
they would attack a city or take out a city or another major
attack. And of course you know you heard about the Muslims on
that one Army base who were training, seventeen of them went
AWOL and are missing now, and they are worried about that. But
I thought it would be something like that. Some Muslim sting
gone bad, or something like that. I never thought that these
people were this nuts to set up this sort of catastrophe. Did
you see it coming at all?
Dr. Fetzer: Not at all. No, not at all, Jim.
Dr. Viken: And it is pretty slick, really.
These people are very craft, aren't they?
Dr. Fetzer: Well, my concern is that they are
stupid, that they aren't far-sighted, that they aren't anticipating
the potential consequences for the entire earth. I mean we live
in a precarious situation. I mean, life only occurred on earth
because of an unusual combination of circumstances and this
is throwing the ecological balance off in such a serious way
that I doubt very much that most forms of life are going to
be able to continue to sustain.
Dr. Viken: But they think they can gene splice
your artificial protein and create their own purified water
and stuff for only a small percentage of the population of the
super elite, so it does not necessarily go against their plan.
But if you ask the question "Cui Bono?" or who benefits
from this, you have to conclude that every major international
crisis always helps the countries involved. Now this is the
greatest boon to power in Washington, D.C. that we have ever
had. This is bigger than 9/11. Because the more trouble we have
down there, let us just say we have a hurricane, and you know
there are reports that they come in out of contaminated rain
in some off the coastal areas. There are some plants that are
spotted. This just came in today.
Dr. Fetzer: I am not surprised, because they
were using this extremely toxic dispersant that was actually
suppressing the oil to keep it away from the surface, but the
waters of the Caribbean are so warm that it was evaporating
into the clouds and now falling as rain on the Eastern Seaboard.
Dr. Viken: That's right. I guess oil itself,
and with crude oil itself, you don't need this additive Corexit.
You don't even need that. The oil itself is bad enough with
all the contaminants.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes.
Dr. Viken: Apparently they are starting to
get this on the analysis. Let us say we have hurricane and some
medium weather catastrophes down there. That will only increase
the damage. Now let us just say that people are starting to
have breathing problems. Some initial reports of increased problems
from allergic reactions and difficulty breathing, and whatever,
if these reports turn out to be true, if there are problems,
are they going to have to move people out of the coastal areas?
Are they going to have to evacuate them?
Dr. Fetzer: Yes, yes, yes.
Dr. Viken: Is this another Katrina thing?
Dr. Fetzer: You know, most populations around
the world are located on the coastlines of the countries involved,
and that if you have to have a mass evacuation you are talking
about millions upon millions of people moving to the north,
Dr. Viken: That's right.
Dr. Fetzer: You are talking about catastrophic
conditions where there is going to be a struggle for survival.
I mean it boggles the mind to contemplate what could occur here.
Dr. Viken: That is right. In other words, I
think there were a hundred other countries that offered ships
and booms and everything and suction tankers and everything
to help. They were all refused. And then the shippers that came
back, the government officials said, "They wanted to charge
us." But I never heard whether that was verified or not.
But our government refused to allow these other entities to
Dr. Fetzer: But as a cost-benefit analysis,
using them and allowing them to charge is overwhelmingly less
expensive than allowing this catastrophe to develop.
Dr. Viken: Of course. We beat everything that
they do out there, what is the difference? I say get as many
entities in there working to solve this crises, because it hurts
-- the reason these countries sent these ships was not just
to be nice guys, because they are afraid they will be harmed
Dr. Fetzer: Very, very, very scary stuff stuff,
Jim. Very scary stuff.
Dr. Viken: And you have to ask yourself, why
is there no honesty? Why is there no honest discussion of any
of these realities in the media? Well, it is because the shadow
government controls the media. You know the only free media
that we have are shows like yours or the Internet. And of course
now the government at the highest levels -- they are spooked
by the Internet. They realize they really screwed up when they
funded DARPA, to set up the Internet. The Internet is out of
control and 95% of the government's problems are now coming
from the Internet and the education people are getting on the
Internet. They are not watching TV very much at all. The news
shows are failing in their viewership. Local newspapers are
failing. People are tired of all the lies. Once you wake up,
once you know that 9/11 was an inside job, hardly any government
lie works anymore. And so that is why there has been a complete
taboo. People at every level of the news have been told "Don't
you ever dare talk about 9/11 where it could possibly be an
inside job." That is the kiss of death for a career.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes, it is stunning. It is like
all the members of Congress took an oath to never discuss it.
I mean you know --
Dr. Viken: That is right.
Dr. Fetzer: How ridiculous is that? I thought
that truth and justice were part of the American way? Now it
turns out to be lies and abuse is the theme of the United States.
Dr. Viken: Well sure, and they passed a law
in Congress a couple of years ago that if you annoy a Congressman
you can be arrested, so now they are starting to enforce it.
If you write a letter to your Congressman saying "I am
mad at you because I don't like the way you are acting out,
you know, resign, and all this and that," they will come
and arrest you for annoying a Congressman.
Dr. Fetzer: You are kidding me!
Dr. Viken: No, they have been doing it.
Dr. Fetzer: If you can't criticize your government,
what does it mean to be an American?
Dr. Viken: Well, they don't consider us as
citizens. They consider us as serfs.
Dr. Fetzer: Serfs.
Dr. Viken: It is the people.
Dr. Fetzer. Serfs!
Dr. Viken: And it is like Bush said, "The
Constitution is just a G-D piece of paper."
Dr. Fetzer: [sarcastically] That's right, just
a goddamn piece of paper.
Dr. Viken: Did anything change under Obama?
He promised to be out of Iraq in 30 days. It was on video. He
promised all these things, open government. He put stuff up
on the Internet two weeks in advance. All lies. He has not done
one thing, Jim, that he promised. He is a liar.
Dr. Fetzer: He has not rescinded the Patriot
Act. The Supreme Court just upheld this terrible provision of
the Military Commissions Act. He has not closed Guantanamo.
He has not brought the troops home from Iraq. He sent more to
Afghanistan. He has given the absurd justification it was because
we were attacked on 9/11 from that region, which means the guy
is a complete dolt and does not understand anything about 9/11.
Dr. Viken: Well Jim, no one is holding his
feet to the fire. The media is not holding him accountable.
Nobody is holding him accountable. The people are all going
to their soccer games, their football games, their baseball
games and turning on the TV and inoculating their brains with
mind control. It is bizarre. It is the most bizarre thing. And
then of course they have got the cell phone towers cranking
out the pulse microwaves to tranquilize everybody. Everybody
is losing everything, but it is all kind of OK, "I will
just go along." It is amazing, just absolutely amazing.
Did you ever think people would be so narcotized by TV and the
media to the point that they don't even try to protect their
Dr. Fetzer: Sheeple, sheeple, sheeple.
Dr. Viken: Yes. You have got to remember you
and all these people, Jim, since the early part of the century
they have been working on developing a mind control method to
PSYOP the people. Now you know yourself that in academia, when
you create a field of studies, and you get the best minds working
on it, you can investigate things and you can really get control
of the situation. And you know how science works. And we have
all these top scientists working for the government coming up
with the best ways to control people. The media is professionally
controlled. They have think tanks that are working 40 hours
a week just thinking how to present sound bytes and various
things to control people. They use pupilometry, meters on people's
pupils. They measure reactions. Nothing goes out over the air
that is not completely engineered. Now when you have this level
of sophistication, the average joker on the street doesn't have
a chance, Jim.
Dr. Fetzer: Yes. Doesn't have a chance. Yes.
Dr. Viken: And that is what we are up against.
You have to ask yourself, the real question to me, I would like
to ask, is why would someone such as yourself step outside of
the box. I would like to know how come you have always been
able to sniff this stuff out. You never bought the government
crap. Ever since I have known you, you have always caught on,
you have always smelled a rat with this stuff. Why were you
able to do that? Is it something about your upbringing. What
is it? Are you just a truth junkie, what is it?
Dr. Fetzer: God, I wish I could tell you. Jim,
it is just I like to --
Dr. Viken: You won't buy any of it, you never
have. It goes all the way back.
Dr. Fetzer: I look for alternative explanations
at what is going on, and of course, you know, the distrust of
the government comes fairly early on if you are paying attention.
Dr. Viken: Is it your orientation, the truth,
or is it your philosophy? Have you always tuned into how the
media is manipulated? You know the logic used by the major mass
media, it violates almost every rule of logic.
Dr. Fetzer: Well, you are right about that.
I mean I spent 35 years teaching logic, critical thinking, and
scientific reasoning to college students, Jim. You know, that
was my greatest contribution. I told them that if they come
to a university to take only one course, this was the course
they should take.
Dr. Viken: What would happen if people really
understood logic? Would they not be able to listen to this crap
on TV news?
Dr. Fetzer: Well they would see through it
all relatively effortlessly. It is astounding to me Jim how
many seemingly sophisticated people are still taken in by the
lies and deceptions of 9/11.
Dr. Viken: It is basic violations of the rules
of logic, Jim.
Dr. Fetzer: Well, there are some pretty elementary
principles going on here, but it also helps, Jim, to have some
background in science. If you understand the nature of scientific
reasoning it is far less easy to be taken in.
Dr. Viken: That is right. You have never bought
it. I have never bought it. I think that the reason was that
I was surrounded by people at an early age, some of them were
in the upper crust, and they would make snide comments -- [a
period of silence].
Dr. Fetzer: Jim, are you there? Jim, are you
there. I think we have lost our guest. I hope he will be back.
Jim Viken, talking about what is going on, let us see if we
can get him back. I must say, this is -- Jim, are you there?
The BP disaster is unbelievable. Anyone should go to my Face
book page for example and they will find some of the latest
articles about what is happening in relation to BP. [51:41 start
of music....end of music 53:00]
Dr. Fetzer: Returning to the air with my special
guest today, Jim Viken. These things seem to me to not be completely
accidental, my friend.
Dr. Viken: Maybe.
Dr. Fetzer: Well, here we are, Jim, you were
saying how important it is for people to be able to see through
what the government tells them. And that critical thinking,
for example, is a helpful background. Am I right?
Dr. Viken: Yes, Jim, I think the key is, I
know that reading your books on the Kennedy assassination, the
three books that you wrote, the first time anything was laid
out from a strictly science of logic perspective with scientific
evidence. And to me, that is always the best approach. Just
look at the facts, let them speak for themselves. And those
books had a big impact on me because they shredded the government
positions, the Warren Commission and the official government
position on the Kennedy assassination.
Dr. Fetzer: Well, I recently did a piece on
Bobby and Jack. Their deaths, on Voltairenet.com, which is archived
on my web site at Jamesfetzer.blogspot.com
where it can be found and traced back to Voltaire, and I encourage
anyone who wants a kind of summary overview to take a look there,
because in very brief compass I explain the basic elements of
both assassinations. It is entitled JFK
and RFK, the Plots that Killed Them, the Patsies that Didn't.
Dr. Viken: Yes, I read it Jim, it was excellent.
I think you nailed it.
Dr. Fetzer: What do we do about this BP disaster,
Jim? Are we just going to have to sit tight and take it. Are
we going to have to run the risk of the extinction of the human
species on the planet without uttering a whimp?
Dr. Viken: Well, I think we just do the best
we can. The people at the top who do these things, it isn't
risk free. They are pushing the limits all the time. This could
all backfire on them. There is always a possibility that people
will rise up and try to take the government back. Who knows.
But the bottom line is just love people, do the best you can
to try to help people, tell them the truth, and that is it.
Take one day at a time, and that is all we can do.
Dr. Fetzer: Well, I am very apprehensive because
you get all these reports about the integration of the federal,
state, and local level of law enforcement and military training
is being given by outfits like what used to be known as Blackwater,
and now it is called "Z" to all these enforcement
authorities. And it looks as though we have complete militarization
of law enforcement in the country, too, Jim.
Dr. Viken: Mike Sparks always says the Nazification
Dr. Fetzer: It is interesting you mention Mike,
because he is going to be my special guest for the second hour,
and we are going to talk about General McChrystal and Afghanistan
and Obama and all that, Jim.
Dr. Viken: Yes, he is excellent. I love his
stuff. But he has always said the Nazis did not end in Germany.
That we absorbed them into this country, and they outsmarted
us and took over. He thinks there is an ongoing Nazification
that went all the way through the Bush administration. It would
be interesting for you to find out if he thinks it is still
going on with Obama.
Dr. Fetzer: Well it is certainly astonishing,
isn't it, Operation Paperclip that brought all these Nazis to
America. Scientists, but also others who have not given up their
basic principles for the dominance of an elite over the subservient
population, and when you talked about serfs and masters, Jim,
you are talking the same language.
Dr. Viken: Yes. But Jim, declassified documents
showed 9,000 were brought over here under Operation Paperclip.
Dr. Fetzer: 9,000. And given key positions
too, I understand, in many cases.
Dr. Viken: That is right.
Dr. Fetzer: That is very scary, Jim, very scary.
Dr. Viken: That is right. That is right.
Dr. Fetzer: Well, my friend, I cannot thank
you enough for coming on this show on the first hour with the
BP disaster. I think it is extremely frightening and I hope
we are wrong about this Jim, but I mean the evidence is all
on the side of apprehension and concern.
Dr. Viken: That's right.
Dr. Fetzer: And we are confronting imminent
Dr. Viken: Thanks for everything you do, Jim,
I appreciate your work.
Dr. Fetzer: My great pleasure. This is Jim
Fetzer, your host on the Real Deal, thanking my special guest
this first hour, Jim Viken, for coming on to talk about the
BP Disaster. Stand by, I will be right back. [57:36].
Mike Sparks Interview
Dr. James Fetzer: [1:02:20] This is Jim Fetzer,
with my special guest for the second hour, Mike Sparks. Mike,
it is a great pleasure to have you on. You have got all this
weird stuff going on in the world, including Obama, Afghanistan,
McChrystal. What in the world is going on here?
Mike Sparks: Well it seems like what is happening
is some power elites are making some moves and the word is that
the BP oil leak is not an accident. To have the president of
BP moving his stock before the prices, so it looks like guilty
to me all the way on his part. And nobody is questioning him
about that. And that shows foreknowledge that something bad
was going to happen. Now there are two theories about how that
could unfold. One, deliberate sabotage. There are reports a
boat pulled up along beside the Deep Horizon offshore drill
rig and were doing some fishy things when an explosion took
place. And then the other theory is that what they were doing
is fundamentally unsound. The place where they are drilling
at was was a place where there was a pocket of high pressure
oil and gas and it was unsound and unsafe for BP to be drilling
there, so the idea is that if you know what you are doing, and
you are an experienced, knowledgeable professional, for you
to drill there means you know you are going to bank on an accident
happening. But it is not an accident, of course. It is like
if you go into a room and it is like full of fireworks and you
light a match, kind of thing. You know it is going to turn out
Dr. Fetzer: Yes.
Mike Sparks: The whole thing about the oil
well thing, you know, pouring out millions of gallons is that
the Russians have already had this problem before, and five
times they used a small nuclear device and blew the channel
closed. I made a video of it, in fact, on my YouTube video channel
called "Nuke, Baby, Nuke." But I don't hear anybody
talking about it, which means to me that people don't want to
solve this problem, not to use nukes. Then I say, well just
use explosives, then. You can get the equivalent size explosion,
you just have to use more explosives, more work, but the way
they are saying it will unfold will not be until mid-August,
until the second oil drilling operation well will be dug, and
that is another 60 days, we are talking about.
Dr. Fetzer: Well the reports I am getting Mike
are that this thing could go on for years and there are as much
as a billion barrels of oil there.
Mike Sparks. That is why I say, "Nuke,
Baby, Nuke." Call the U.S. military and say "Out of
the way, BP, and point a nuclear device adjacent to it, talk
to the Russians, find out where you need to place it, set the
nuclear device underground, under the seabed, explode the earth
adjacent to the oil channel, close it up.
Dr. Fetzer: Well, but Mike I understand the
whole seabed is fragmented. The whole Gulf basin is fragile,
and that it is leaking from multiple positions, and you cannot
any longer stop it. It looks like we have a catastrophe on our
hands of unimaginable proportions.
Mike Sparks: Well, right, and I have read some
things, especially from the NASA guide, Richard Hoagland saying
that there is a gas bubble forming, and all that. And the bottom
line is that the President of the United States and the National
Security Council have to take charge of this situation. These
people who caused the problem, BP are in way over their head.
And the national heavyweights have to be put in.
Dr. Fetzer: Mike, we spent the last hour on
BP and the Gulf of Mexico disaster with Jim Viken, and I just
want to know your take on what is going on with Afghanistan,
Obama, and McChrystal. That really stuns me in so many ways.
I read his article in Rolling Stone. I personally did
not think it was all that bad. I mean certainly there was some
contempt being shown for the civilian leaders of the government,
but that doesn't mean that, you know, what McChrystal represents
is therefore wrong. It may be wrong, but it is not because he
is showing some contempt for his civilian superiors.
Mike Sparks: Well, from what I have read so
far...[end of this transcript, which is focused on the BP Catastrophe].